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Tuesday, June 23, 2026

  1. * skillbot1 joined #primate
  2. * skillbot joined #primate
  3. bluedreamreal: you're not gonna like this
  4. dreamrealwhat am I not going to like
  5. bluedreamreal: I've been getting into golang
  6. dreamrealwhy would I care about that?
  7. dreamrealHell, I had a conversation yesterday when FOXPRO came up
  8. dreamrealgo has a lot going for it. I think Rust is better, still, but eh
  9. dreamrealin the end it's all machine language
  10. bluedreamreal: I KNOW you hate go!
  11. bluemaybe not as much as you hate python, probably
  12. dreamrealI don't hate go. I dislike python, actively despise tcl but for reasons, don't like ruby much, but most others I'm pretty neutral about. Typescript I dislike as well, more than JS, which I find amusing, but I have reasons there too!
  13. blueI'd say on your negative list, there's scala, python, then go
  14. blueI think the language I historically despise the most is php, even though it had one of my fav frameworks, paradoxically
  15. dreamrealThen you should ask me instead! The truth is: I LIKE scala-the-language. I hate scala-the-ecosystem. I dislike python because significant whitespace offends me and it damn well should. I dislike typescript because it LIES about its type system. If you STAY in TS it's fine, and useful, but it's trivial to decay to JS, and boom, breakage.
  16. dreamrealI don't know PHP so I can't judge it.
  17. bluephp is just a poor excuse for a language, really, no structure at all, it's just cobbled together nonsense
  18. dreamrealGo is okay; I find it relatively paltry and the "batteries included" mindset is useful but amusing.
  19. dreamrealRuby is very meh, it's like someone said "let's look at python and fix the whitespace problem" without fixing some of the other problems they shoudl ALSO have addressed.
  20. dreamrealI despise tcl because of Vignette Storyserver. tcl *by itself* is probably fine but I found storyserver scarring.
  21. blueyou're wrong about that, though. TS doesn't lie about anything, it's just used by a host of morons, above all me, and they ENJOY those lies, in fact they embrace them
  22. dreamrealWell, to ME a typed thing is very easy to subvert in TS
  23. dreamrealbecause JS doesn't have it
  24. dreamrealI know they've fixed the Object.prototype.hasOwnProperty() thing to be something different now but that STILL makes me angry
  25. blueonce you stop looking at TS as a language and more like an LSP impl, it all makes sense
  26. dreamrealI never thought it DIDN'T make sense. I just don't care for it.
  27. dreamreal(in storyserver, IF, if, and If all had different semantic meanings.)
  28. dreamrealso if you like go, rock on wif yo bad self!
  29. bluethere are things I actively despise about it. like the fact `const foo = ["a", "b"];` will expand to string[]
  30. bluewhilst if you really want it to be `readonly ["a, "b"]`, you need to add `as const`
  31. bluethis has implications that break a core rule of programming, which is, trivial abstractions shouldn't modify semantics
  32. dreamrealsure
  33. blueie: `some_library.config({ "foo": bar })` // works
  34. blueer, should have been foo: "bar"
  35. dreamrealwhich ties into why I don't like tcl and storyserver: if you can see the differences between those three if expressions, I'd love to know how and why
  36. bluemeanwhilst, `const conf = { foo: "bar" }; some_library.config(conf);` // will fail, since conf is { foo: string }
  37. blueiow, those anonymous objects imply `as const`
  38. blueobv the key to solve this is type `const conf = { foo: "bar" }` with no expansion
  39. blueand if you really want a { foo: string}, you could still type it out, ie `const conf: { foo: string } = { foo: "bar"};`
  40. bluemagic is deadly!
  41. dreamrealyep
  42. bluedreamreal: curious case. I've got a email from contabo (my vps hoster) that they're raising the prices because of electricity costs and war and blablabla. and then, they offer for me, for the *raised* price, to switch to the next tier plan which is double the pcus, double the ram, and double the storage
  43. blueI must be the missing something
  44. blues/the //
  45. blueI mean, I'm not gonna say no to 24gb RAM instead of 12gb. I wanted more ram anyway, for repopack
  46. bluebut I feel like the electricity costs is just an excuse, lol
  47. bluethe raise priced isn't earth-shattering, either. from 7.91 to 9.52 euro
  48. blueso I *really* don't mind getting double the buck for roughly 1.2 of the bang
  49. blueit's just curious
  50. blueand my stupid ape brain doesn't like curious
  51. bluemoreover, the same plan, if I were a new customer, costs roughly 14, paid annually, and probably more monthly
  52. * jreicher joined #primate
  53. * phaleth joined #primate
  54. bluephaleth: hi, ssh2 is implemented
  55. bluefyi https://github.com/mscdex/ssh2/issues/1478#issuecomment-4770501899
  56. nevetPost-quantum safe kex algorythm? 路 Issue #1478 路 mscdex/ssh2
  57. phalethhi blue
  58. phalethyeah, already noticed
  59. blueso the ssh2 solution is generally better -- less code, less deployment complexity. however, that PQC notice is annoying, and I know it's gonna annoy users and lead to complaints
  60. bluefor now it's acceptable, but we might need to pivot to openssh if this becomes too much of an issue and the guy doesn't add the mixed algo
  61. * phaleth joined #primate
  62. phalethI guess the build or even other output messages will have to be modified anyway
  63. blueya
  64. * jreicher joined #primate