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Tuesday, October 6, 2026

  1. * skillbot joined #primate
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  4. jreicherIs the window-within-the-window behaviour that happens with bytecode.news a primate thing?
  5. bluewhat window-within-the-window?
  6. jreicherGo to https://pudl.bytecode.news/logs and click on one of the channels. By default it should come up as a window within the page, rather than a new page.
  7. bluebut that's pudl jreicher, not primate
  8. jreicherI don't really understand PUDL yet, but I wouldn't have thought the choice of design language gives you some behaviours immediately.
  9. bluepudl is completely unrelated to primate, to my knowledge
  10. jreicherOh...
  11. jreicherI'm still trying to understand how BCN is put together
  12. bluejreicher: it's kind of confusing. PUDL is both a design language, but there's also a standard impl (in JS)
  13. blueI think dreamreal is using both. however, that nothing to do with primate
  14. bluethat has*
  15. jreicherIt's really nice it's using primate though. I didn't know that until recently.
  16. bluetrue
  17. bluedreamreal moved just recently to primate
  18. jreicherI feel a bit strange saying this, but I'm really happy for you. Having someone else use your work is one of the nicest things that can happen.
  19. bluethank you jreicher. yes, I said the same to dreamreal
  20. dreamrealjreicher: yo
  21. dreamrealwhat's the question?
  22. dreamrealjreicher: oh
  23. dreamrealPUDL is a ridiculous name, and i've told its author so - even while appreciating the humor in it. But it's basically a desktop in the web, windowing, the works, and is a standard (or wants to be). Paul's been doing work similar to it for decades, and only recently has it turned into PUDL itself - it's had good implementations before but nothing like this, IMO.
  24. dreamrealBut BCN is built on three layers: a DB (postgres), an app (kotlin/spring), and a pluggable front end, so it has a primate front end (the "main site"), a pudl front end, a nextjs front end, a JSF front end that bores me, etc
  25. dreamrealso what happens is a "new feature" gets scoped: it might be the app, which is a massive ingress/egress workflow engine (takes input from irc, slack, discord, mattermost, mail, http), AND/OR the front end (i.e., pudl's factoid editing stuff, which is a little ahead of the other apps, although that functionality will get ported)
  26. dreamrealand implementation tends to go from the lowest level to the highest (i.e., right now I'm working on factoids again, which means the app changes, and then the front ends adapt)
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  28. * blue!~blue@user/blue changed the topic to: https://primate.run | this channel is mirrored to the Primate discord, channel #irc
  29. dreamreal(I'm deploying a factoid update right now, for example - that's why nevet restarted.)
  30. dreamrealThe front ends don't HAVE to be efficient - they rely on the backend for data and operations, but they should be able to run properly while the backend is restarting, and they do
  31. jreicherdreamreal: I don't really have a question. I was just wondering at the behaviour of a window for each of the log views. It's uncommon in my experience (and that's not a criticism)
  32. dreamrealOh, it's uncommon. The pudl front end feels like MOST of a desktop for bytecode would
  33. dreamrealFrom my sample set most people see the pudl app and go "whoa, neat" but vastly prefer the actual main page for usage
  34. dreamrealas an ADMIN, I barely bother with the primate version except for sharing and checking, because teh feature set for pudl is so much better for editing - both are SPA but pudl allows me to operate in multiple aspects at the same time, whereas the main site has to put it all in the same frame - that's a *design* thing, not an implementation thing, primate could do it
  35. dreamrealfor that matter, primate could use pudl
  36. jreicherSorry, brb.
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  38. dreamrealyo jreicher
  39. dreamrealhttps://bytecode.news/posts/2026/10/testcontainers-and-reuse
  40. dreamrealSomeone slap that on HN and lobste.rs if you have an account
  41. dreamrealblue: primate also BUILDS faster than the nextjs app, the actual mechanics of it
  42. bluedreamreal: there's actually more to it. I don't know how next handles it, so can't speak to that. but generally speaking, primate builds *self-contained* .js files in the `build` directory. that has a few implications. you can completely separate build and run server, *and* you don't need npm on the run server, just node/deno/bun
  43. bluethe primate build process has been optimised to a high degree to achieve that, because the `node_modules` folder is typically a blackhole, and I did not want to require npm in deployment
  44. dreamrealblue: post that url to HN, I want to see if it shows up this time
  45. blueoki
  46. dreamrealYou're not actually supposed to SELF-POST, so ...
  47. dreamrealup yet?
  48. bluehttps://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49976944
  49. nevetHacker News
  50. bluecan you see it?
  51. dreamrealI cannot!
  52. dreamrealWhat the heck?
  53. blueI think bytecode.news may have been blacklisted
  54. bluebut unsure
  55. bluedid HN get back to you?
  56. dreamrealNot yet
  57. dreamrealI wonder why it's been blacklisted, if that's the case
  58. dreamrealokay, off to get some exercise in
  59. dreamrealwas really hoping to see the HN effect :/
  60. blueya :(
  61. bluedreamreal: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49977000
  62. nevetTestcontainers and Reuse | Hacker News
  63. bluethere we go, fixed it for ya
  64. dreamrealWhat was it?
  65. blueI used a different account from the one previously used to post the blacklisted url
  66. dreamreal... what
  67. dreamrealthat's... odd
  68. dreamrealand there it goes!
  69. bluenot inherently: it appears their content mitigation strategy empoys a combination of url/domain/history
  70. blueemploys*
  71. bluethat's why I have like five different HN accounts, because HN is so finicky
  72. blueI also posted from a vpn, to be sure there is no link
  73. dreamrealinteresting. That could explain it, yeah.
  74. blueI do not know, obviously, how the algo works. my hunch: too much 'promotion' (the same host url from the same account), gets the *account* + url blacklisted
  75. dreamreallots of TX, low CPU usage, woo
  76. blueand since I previously had hans post the blacklisted url, he apparently got blacklisted (for bytecode.news), as well
  77. blueso when he tried to post *this* one, it failed too
  78. blueanyway, saru got it done
  79. dreamrealI *really* want to see this on HN's front page
  80. dreamrealWould be a fantastic test
  81. dreamrealI think the system's about stable as a whole: I'm running out of trivial features to add :D
  82. blueya
  83. bluedreamreal: at 6 pts now
  84. bluedreamreal: 7, still not ratio'd/homepage'd
  85. dreamrealyeah
  86. dreamrealback
  87. dreamrealI think it's topping out
  88. dreamreal:(
  89. blue:(
  90. dreamrealSuch is life
  91. bluesometimes though it happens a bit later
  92. bluetheir algo for placing something on the hp, is rather weird, as well
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  94. * blue!~blue@user/blue changed the topic to: https://primate.run | this channel is mirrored to the Primate discord, channel #irc
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  96. * blue!~blue@user/blue changed the topic to: https://primate.run | this channel is mirrored to the Primate discord, channel #irc
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